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[-] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 78 points 5 days ago

The discourse around Biden exiting the race is moot because the only one who decides if he continues is Biden. Biden is still running so nothing changes. Biden is who we need to vote for to keep our democracy.

Biden had a bad debate performance. It was a missed opportunity to pick up new voters. Biden demoralized his base. But we're still stuck with him, because there is no external mechanism to stop him from running.

The most effective tool we have to prevent the christo-fascist takeover this November is voting. The debate did not change that.

[-] Tinidril@midwest.social 32 points 5 days ago

the only one who decides if he continues is Biden.

Got it.

Biden is who we need to vote for to keep our democracy.

Um, what? Vote Biden to save Democracy, and fuck you if you want a different candidate.

I'll vote for Biden's corpse in 2028 if it's still the only way to keep Trump out of the Whitehouse, but give up the "save Democracy" schtick. That ship has sailed. Democracy is dead, and it's not just the Republican's fault.

[-] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 19 points 5 days ago

Democracy is still alive for now. That's why voting matters. Our flawed democracy is still our best chance at adverting fascism. Which is why the fascists want to take it away. Giving up early gets us nothing. So keep fighting.

[-] pjwestin@lemmy.world 11 points 5 days ago

I think his point is that, if our only alternative to fascism is to vote for a senile old man who was forced upon voters without a primary, then this system can't credibly be called democracy.

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[-] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 17 points 5 days ago

I don't understand this chain of logic why we need to keep Biden:

  1. Biden isn't the best candidate.

  2. Only Biden can drop (false)

  3. Biden will never make the adult decision to retire.

  4. We have to plow forward with Biden because he'll never change his mind on anything.

Like, the argument for why Biden has to stay, is just reasons he shouldn't stay...

And it's not just up to him. It's up to the DNC.

We are not stuck with Biden.

Biden and the DNC just know that's the only way people will vote for him, so they've been reporting it for like 5 years now.

[-] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 5 days ago

Only Biden can drop

This is a true statement. Biden won the primary. The delegates are pledged to him. Biden is the one who has to decide if he drops out.

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[-] MataVatnik@lemmy.world 9 points 5 days ago

Ah yes, the DNC, known for making good decisions for our democracy. How they trusted Hillary on us leading to the election of Trump.

We just need ranked choice voting at a national scale. Until that happens we're going to keep dealing with this bullshit. A lot of Republicans don't want to elect a fascist anymore than a lot of democrats don't want to elect a geriatric. But just like democrats a lot of those Republicans think they have no choice. These could all have been avoided with a different voting system and the more moderate members of each party could have voted together.

I agree with you, but the system is just fucking broken.

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[-] rayyy@lemmy.world 11 points 5 days ago

The guy didn't ace a debate with a sore throat and jet-lag so the media loses its shit. The orange liar has rape and 34 felony convictions- crickets. Nothing new here.

[-] AmidFuror@fedia.io 9 points 5 days ago

I searched for an editorial board opinion in the New York Times which said Trump should withdraw from the Republican ticket because he lied throughout the debate, but I couldn't find one. Why didn't they write one?

[-] FenrirIII@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

Because the media is complicit and owned by the same oligarchs that have taken control of our country.

[-] timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works 5 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

There are two standards. Everyone expects Republicans to be lying shitheads so when they are, no one is surprised.

We somehow just accept this.

[-] match@pawb.social 7 points 5 days ago

sounds like the party is dysfunctional if we can't replace a candidate with 120 days of leadup. that's longer than any other country's election season. the inability of the democratic party to do good things on purpose makes a strong argument against their leadership if what they think they offer is competence

[-] mal3oon@lemmy.world 10 points 5 days ago

I thought the 2016 Bernie debacle was enough of a learning moment for the Democrats, yet 8 years go so long for memory lane. Biden is barely functional, anyone with old grandparents know how fast things accelerate, how is he even going to last 5 more years with that mental capacity? Isn't this at the end blind party loyalty, the same thing the republicans are criticized for? I guess rules for thee but not for me.

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[-] emax_gomax@lemmy.world 3 points 4 days ago

Can the party not compel him to step down and elect a more healthy replacement.

[-] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 4 days ago

There is no mechanism at this stage that can force him to do so that I am aware of. They can of course try to convince him, but no one from Biden's inner circle, like Jill Biden, or any of the hypothetical candidates people like to float, like Gavin Newsom, has expressed interest in doing that.

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[-] Rottcodd@lemmy.world 44 points 5 days ago

I pessimistically expected that.

If he bowed out and the Dems nominated a halfway decent candidate (which they likely wouldn't do, but that's a different subject), they'd demolish Trump. He'd lose so badly he couldn't even pretend it was fraudulent (though of course he'd claim that anyway, since he has the emotional maturity of a spoiled five-year-old). The race would instantly go from a terrifying risk to a complete rout.

But between Biden's ego and the DNC's determination to stick with a wholly-owned establishment neoliberal hack at all costs - even if it means losing - I expected that they wouldn't take this golden opportunity.

[-] CrabAndBroom@lemmy.ml 38 points 5 days ago

On the stream of the debate I was watching, when they took a break they showed clips from previous debates and the difference was kind of mind-blowing.

I honestly kind of think that even a mid-level candidate who didn't make it like Romney or Kerry probably could have mopped the floor with either one of them.

Also as a side note, how lucky is Donald Trump? Just a whole life of being handed infinite money no matter how many times he fucked up a business, a bewildering assortment of crimes with essentially no hard consequences, and two presidential runs against pretty much the only two people he has any chance of beating in a debate.

He's had a life of almost non-stop softballs. It's kind of wild really.

[-] JustZ@lemmy.world 4 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Well he's had the KGB in Russian mining oligarchs looking out for him for the last 40 years.

[-] timbuck2themoon@sh.itjust.works 9 points 4 days ago

This is simply fan fic.

[-] Jordan117@lemmy.world 17 points 5 days ago

But between Biden's ego and the DNC's determination to stick with a wholly-owned establishment neoliberal hack at all costs - even if it means losing - I expected that they wouldn't take this golden opportunity.

Biden has objectively been the most progressive president since LBJ, and the most effective progressive president since FDR. And he did it with about the slimmest possible congressional margins, a situation which would have made it very easy for an actual "establishment neoliberal hack" to say "my hands are tied" and accomplish nothing of substance. Instead we got the biggest climate reform package ever, the biggest infrastructure package since the Interstate Highway system, a child tax credit that massively reduced child poverty, the most significant industrial policy in decades (CHIPS and Science), a veritable bulldog FTC chair with an aggressive anti-monopoly stance, and that's just for starters.

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[-] jettrscga@lemmy.world 9 points 5 days ago

Who exactly? I think you underestimate the power of being an incumbent.

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[-] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 29 points 5 days ago

“I know I’m not a young man, to state the obvious,” the 81-year-old Biden said Friday. “I don’t walk as easy as I used to. I don’t speak as smoothly. I don’t debate as well as I used to. But I know what I do know. I know how to tell the truth. I know right from wrong and I know how to do this job.”

trump didn't think he was wrong when he was breaking human rights laws on our southern border.

And Biden apparently doesn't either now that he's doing it.

My point being the people who do evil shit, usually dont think of themselves as evil.

The problem with Biden, is on issues like Israel where the vast majority of not only his party but the country won't him him to calm the fuck down. He never will

Because he is absolutely sure his outdated morals are the best, and he's not listening to anyone that disagrees with him.

[-] smokin_shinobi@lemmy.world 38 points 5 days ago

This gonna be the first time you have to choose between the lesser of two evils?

[-] Sanctus@lemmy.world 37 points 5 days ago

Personally, that has been the only way I've ever been able to fucken vote and I'm sick of it.

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[-] FuglyDuck@lemmy.world 9 points 5 days ago

The lesser of two evils is exactly how we fucking got her in the first place.

[-] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 9 points 5 days ago

You get a chance to vote for your dream candidate in the primary.

If they're not on the ballot in the general, that's because other voters didn't find your dream candidate so dreamy.

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[-] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 7 points 5 days ago

They know and they love it.

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[-] bdonvr@thelemmy.club 8 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

That quote is so stupid.

"yeah I'm in cognitive and physical decline, but I'm totally capable of leading one of the most powerful and influential nations in history. Trust me bro."

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[-] Shyfer@ttrpg.network 14 points 5 days ago

At least he sounded a lot more energetic and present in this speech. What happened on stage?

[-] ShinkanTrain@lemmy.ml 7 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

Didn't have a teleprompter on stage

[-] Zaktor@sopuli.xyz 15 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

You also don't really need to think for a speech. You've got a friendly audience who won't challenge you and you know exactly what the next topic is, so you can focus on inflection and timing and emotion. It's good to see him have some life in the speech, but it's not really much of a counter to his terrible debate performance.

And incidentally, that's probably why Trump's performance sounded better. He also didn't really need to think about substance because he was just speaking to whatever topic he felt like and making things up without concern for truthfulness or challenge.

[-] explodicle@sh.itjust.works 3 points 4 days ago

I think he was just sick on an unlucky day.

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[-] Nobody@lemmy.world 12 points 5 days ago

Biden could commit to only serving one more year and let the VP pick go to a brokered convention.

[-] ToastedPlanet@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 5 days ago

Biden has already committed to serving four more years.

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this post was submitted on 29 Jun 2024
188 points (95.6% liked)

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