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submitted 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) by Blackout@kbin.run to c/mildlyinfuriating@lemmy.world

I dont know why they have to lie about it. At $5/8ft board you'd think I paid for the full 1.5. Edit: I mixed up nominal with actual.

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[-] Carighan@lemmy.world 169 points 7 months ago

Shouldn't the normal size be 2? Given, well, the name?

[-] InEnduringGrowStrong@sh.itjust.works 172 points 7 months ago

You'd think so, but no.
Short story is the 'nominal' size is the size before going into a planer to smooth the faces.
Yes, it makes little sense, like many things related to construction stuff.

[-] cosmicrookie@lemmy.world 111 points 7 months ago

Yeah sorry. The tree was originally 50ft tall so we call the pieces that. But you only get 3ft

Is like buying 1200lbs steaks because that's what the cow weighs before it gets parted

[-] SchmidtGenetics@lemmy.world 78 points 7 months ago

Better example would be raw vs cooked weight of a 1/4lb paddy.

[-] AmidFuror@fedia.io 28 points 7 months ago

Exactly. Because it is easier to weigh the correct amount before cooking than find out you were wrong after.

But you should probably be feeding Patrick more.

[-] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 28 points 7 months ago

That's a very small area to grow rice in.

[-] EinfachUnersetzlich@lemm.ee 17 points 7 months ago

Or a very offended Irish person.

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[-] dukatos@lemm.ee 83 points 7 months ago
[-] maniacal_gaff@lemmy.world 24 points 7 months ago

It's not a 2x4 it's a "2x4."

[-] bhmnscmm@lemmy.world 33 points 7 months ago

And if you're a fan of quotation marks you could call it a "2"x4"."

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[-] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 79 points 7 months ago

The two-by-fours at your local home center are not 2 inches thick or 4 inches wide...not anymore at least. They spent several weeks at that size though. The sawmill cut them to that size to stack and kiln dry, and then when removed from the kiln they are then milled straight and square. Used to be they would sell the rough stock to carpenters who would do the milling themselves, but then they figured out that the railroads were charging them a fortune to ship a lot of wood that was going to be ground to sawdust anyway, so they started milling the boards before shipment. Same amount of construction lumber arrives at the construction site and it took less fuel for the locomotive to deliver it.

[-] pearsaltchocolatebar@discuss.online 26 points 7 months ago

they are then milled straight and square

Lol. Trying to find lumber that's straight and square is a pipe dream these days.

[-] Wrench@lemmy.world 23 points 7 months ago

It was straight and square when it was milled. Problem is that the big box stores cut corners during the kiln drying phase, so the boards have a ton of moisture still in them. As that dries, the boards twist and cup.

Plus poor protection from the elements at each storage step, which means rapid temp changes, which also causes wood movement.

Go to a local lumber yard. They tend to do a better job at kiln drying. You're still going to have warped boards, but far fewer in my experience.

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[-] aBundleOfFerrets@sh.itjust.works 51 points 7 months ago

Lumber is weird because it has been industry standard to lie about dimensions since before the US existed so it’s just kinda a thing they get to do

[-] cosmicrookie@lemmy.world 28 points 7 months ago

No its not Maybe in the US? At least here, it is and has to be, very precise especially when it comes to industry quality. It is precise down to the mm!

[-] BruceTwarzen@kbin.social 25 points 7 months ago

Yeah but they measure in feet and cheesburgers.

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[-] themeatbridge@lemmy.world 19 points 7 months ago

It's not exactly a lie, just a standard. Nominal board sizes were based on the unfinished lumber size. Another 1/4 inch is taken off each side to get a smooth surface that makes it easier to work with.

Here's an old image (reddit warning)

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexternal-preview.redd.it%2F6Oy1DmXVFs0lyKxq9OmjaI-2gsPj8QO6joLlY1rB7m4.jpg%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3D4fa73a2eaf8d96d4de26378be1ba9c404b210685

that shows the rough cuts of boards from a log. When they look at a log, they determine how many of each size they can get from it, and at that point, a 2x4 is 2 inches by 4 inches.

Why does the consumer need to know the dimensions at harvest when it's been processed multiple times?

That's like calling an 4oz can of evaporated milk a gallon because it came from a gallon of milk before processing (I have no clue on the ratio)

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[-] Magnetar@feddit.de 45 points 7 months ago

As if american measurements have ever made sense. Look up how they measure screws or wires and despair.

[-] shalafi@lemmy.world 27 points 7 months ago

Or shotgun shell sizes and loads.

"It all started in 1840 when the dram was a common unit of measurement..."

[-] Asafum@feddit.nl 18 points 7 months ago

And they all had onions on their belts as was the style at the time.

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[-] someguy3@lemmy.ca 27 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

The convention is 2" before milling. Milling takes off 1/4"on each side, so the result is 1.5".

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[-] kn33@lemmy.world 21 points 7 months ago

They were when the name was made, but due to changes in the manufacturing process, they aren't anymore. The name stuck, though.

https://www.popsci.com/two-by-four-lumber-measurements-explained/

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[-] Agrivar@lemmy.world 134 points 7 months ago

Is nobody gonna call out OP for wearing socks with sandals? ...and, ostensibly, while preparing to do carpentry?!?

That's like a cardinal sin squared!

[-] jenny_ball@lemmy.world 21 points 7 months ago
[-] Glytch@lemmy.world 23 points 7 months ago
[-] nrezcm@lemmy.world 17 points 7 months ago

No need to crucify him for it.

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[-] bluewing@lemm.ee 15 points 7 months ago

Can't you see those are safety sandals. And just like safety squints, are approved PPE across the whole 3rd world industrial sphere. OP will be perfectly safe.

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[-] Coreidan@lemmy.world 15 points 7 months ago

Nah nothing wrong with wearing socks with sandals when you’re home. Do what ever the hell you want.

But I do agree with wearing proper footwear while doing dangerous things.

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[-] some_guy 90 points 7 months ago

Um, wait. I would think that violates some sort of law (but I guess maybe we haven't codified this?). I mean, building plans expect standards in materials, right? So how can a building meet codes if the materials are not within the expected specs?

[-] RidgeDweller@sh.itjust.works 43 points 7 months ago

Agreed, seems like some kind of weights and measures violation.

[-] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 17 points 7 months ago

I'm going to guess they can get away with this because 2x2s aren't intended for structural use. I've never built one into a floor, wall or ceiling.

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[-] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 16 points 7 months ago

It's probably 2x2PT or something. There are standards for board widths.

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[-] XeroxCool@lemmy.world 57 points 7 months ago

2x2PT has been 1.25x1.25 for as long as I can remember (10 years or more). It's only the pressure treated deck stuff for railings. This does not apply to the rest of the 2x lumber, as those are still 1.5 actual. I got Simpson corner 2x2 brackets for crazy cheap way back but ended up not really using them. The 2x2s are warped to hell and a ripped 2x4 was too big in the original 2x dimension.

[-] Windex007@lemmy.world 17 points 7 months ago

I'm wondering if it's a regional thing? I just looked online for pressure treated 2x2's and all the ones I'm seeing (home hardware, home depot, advantage lumber, etc) list as actual being 1.5x1.5

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[-] el_abuelo@lemmy.ml 54 points 7 months ago

Why is 2x2 meant to be 1.5x1.5 and not 2x2?

[-] pythonoob@programming.dev 34 points 7 months ago

Premill size vs sale size. Something like that. Probably not the correct term.

Similar to how steak is measures in precooked weights.

[-] VeryNiiiice@sh.itjust.works 21 points 7 months ago

2x4 is the rough cut dimensions from the sawmill. They end up smaller after drying (wood can hold a lot of water) and planing.

[-] phx@lemmy.ca 15 points 7 months ago

*Planed/straight wood versus raw lumber. It threw me off when I first started building stuff and summed that a 2x4 was actually 2"x4" in all my measurements/plans

*Or it would be straight if you're lucky and don't pick from the top of the bin at Home Depot

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[-] insufferableninja@lemdro.id 44 points 7 months ago

TBH that looks like a furring strip, not dimensional lumber

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[-] wjrii@lemmy.world 33 points 7 months ago

It's still a bit small, but pressure treated being a little smaller than framing lumber is not necessarily a secret:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Severe-Weather-Common-2-in-x-2-in-x-8-ft-Actual-1-3125-in-x-1-3125-in-x-8-ft-1-Treated-Lumber/4764128

[-] prettybunnys@sh.itjust.works 30 points 7 months ago

I appreciate you covering your open toes, safety socks so you’re compliant.

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[-] A_A@lemmy.world 25 points 7 months ago

How is it in countries using the metric system ?
in France :
https://www.mara-materiaux.com/bois-de-charpente/8094-lambourde-38x63-mm-long4-m-traite-9202001090740.html

LAMBOURDE 38x63 mm long.4 M TRAITE Unité de vente : le mètre linéaire 1.42 € /m
5.68 € /(4 m)

So, this is aprox ($6.?) for one "...2x3x(~13ft)..."
(treated wood)
... verry expensive, yet, upfront size disclosure.

[-] Geth@lemmy.dbzer0.com 23 points 7 months ago

Pretty much all of Europe lists wood in exact size of the cut that you get. It sounds highly illegal to call it a 5x5cm piece of wood and sell some other random smaller size.

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this post was submitted on 07 May 2024
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