You're supposed to use baby talk with them from about 15 years old and until they're 18, to really piss them off.
The little shits have almost certainly done something to deserve it
I have taught my kids to communicate with me solely via email, or via their lawyers.
The secret ingredient is unchecked alcoholism and rampant psychological abuse.
(/s, I don't even have kids)
I have taught my kids to communicate with me entirely in Morse code via blinking.
It's perfect as it's nigh impossible to be interrupted, and back-talk doesn't matter because they look too stupid to even get upset about.
Denying their existence is totally on-brand
Baby-talk is a universal human phenomenal and almost certainly plays an important role in helping kids learn language.
The implication that not using baby talk somehow unlocks rapid development of language is simply not true.
But it's very funny to respond to babies babbling nonsense with "yes, I see, an intriguing point."
Another good one is to suddenly look frightened and stammer out h-how could you know that".
This is why the baby stage is so fun and the teenage stage is so damn annoying.
You can always troll teenagers by using their words in slightly off contexts.
No way my parents did that accidentally!
Conversely, it's also very funny to respond to self-important adults babbling nonsense with baby talk.
Kids perceive a lot more than we might think. I know my parents made lots of well-intentioned, passing comments that were nothing to them but stay with me decades later.
While I agree with you about the funniness, I worry that a kid might justifiably feel condescended to by that response and thus lose trust in the responder, an authority figure - especially if that figure is a parent, which is to say, a person they have to trust as an implicit safe figure.
I want my toddler to feel free to say anything to me, be it gibberish or a deep and well articulated philosophical point, and know that they won't be mocked for it. That's how they know it's okay to explore and, if they wish to, share their thoughts. Even if their thoughts don't make sense to me.
Teasing a kid isn't inherently wrong, but even before they're articulate, your response to their words - or gibberish - matters.
There is a big difference between recoding "I am unable to do this currently because I am tied up with other work, ask me in a few hours" to "Daddy's busy right now sweetie, maybe later?"
and
"Aww whosa sweet wittuh one! My wittle girlie so preshusss!"
Baby talk overemphasizes everything, including repetitions, that makes it easier for babies to actually get what you want and what all those cues are supposed to mean.
So yeah, kind of important, even though it sounds stupid.
That being said, there is a point at which kids should be taken seriously and communicated with accordingly. Some parents talk to relatively old kids like with toddlers and that can't be healthy either.
I think it's both true that baby talk is good for infants and that people infantilize children for far longer than they should
Idk man. There's this 3yr old girl that's a child of one of our family's friends. She's pretty expressive with her vocabulary. Like i can have full blown conversations with this girl without dumbing much down, and i think that might be due to her parents' pedanticalness.
Children pick up language at different rates. But also, while most kids learn words and build up, some learn to deploy whole chunks.
My cousin could say "Excuse me daddy could I please have a cookie?" at like 2 iirc. It sounds very advanced when you hear it, but she couldn't, for example, replace 'a cookie' with 'that' or direct the request to me rather than her dad.
Once kids have learned more and more chunks they can sound very proficient, but it's still just normal child language acquisition. Of course people gifted in language can happen too.
If you treat your kids like an adult they grow up to be one. We see plenty of example of people who are of legal age acting like children. Now you know why.
It definitely works. They'll grow up way faster. Like they'll be out of your life 15 YEARS faster!
When my toddler son hit his sister, instead of giving him a 'talking to' like the parinting book suggested, I just called the cops. Now he's in federal prison all on his own! I'm so proud of him. 🥰
It's one thing to use baby talk with an infant, (hence the baby talk moniker), and another to speak that way to a child that is actually learning to form words and construct a sentence.
Use whatever voice you prefer with your pets. Dogs actually enjoy the soft sounds of baby talk. A bit of brilliant manipulation of humans by the dogs.
i'm pretty sure baby talk came about in the first place because it works, it genuinely helps infants develop and as you say pets generally enjoy it, i think the high pitch is easier for them to hear?
I won't argue with your thought. I'm certainly no accredited expert either, just a dad that, along with my wife, raise 4 daughters and pets - mostly working hunting dogs.
My take is that baby talk is impossible to do in a loud and angry voice. And is always done in a soft and gentle tone. I have noticed that when training dogs, I'm a fan of Spaniels, that if you are speaking in a loud voice and that has angry tones, they will start to separate from you and watch you closely. Because ain't no one wants to get yelled at. It's kind of similar to loud sharp barking I suppose. Cats though, are generally arse holes and just don't care......
When our Daughters were newborns, they started to make just sounds after about a month. So baby talk was was pretty much just making intelligible sounds back at them in a soft and soothing tone. As they started to actually learn and use "real" words, less baby talk and far more normal speech is used by parents I think. But children are also smart enough to know the different between the baby talk when playing peek-a-boo with daddy and then need for normal speech at other times.
I certainly don't see baby talk to infants and small children as an issue except in rare disfunctional family situations.
Once they become teenagers, they mostly communicate through grunts and whines regardless.
I speak to my dog in complete sentences which was a mistake because now she knows every synonym for park, walk, treats, and any time we're referring to her even if we just say 'her,' 'it,' or 'the hound.' She even learned that any time we spell a word it's related to something she likes and she goes bonkers.
"They're deliberately trying not to look like they're talking about me!"
"They must be talking about me!"
We had a dog once that was super smart and would learn what different words meant very rapidly. I'd say with most dogs I've had, you can go most of their life and they'll maybe learn 2-3 different words for "dinner" and you can use other words if you're trying not to excite them too much. But this dog I swear near the end of her life we would have to say ridiculous things around her like "Did you put the K9 cereal in the receptacle?" because she had learned just about every other basic way to say "did you feed the dog?".
Not sure why this triggered a snarky response unless Ted is just waving a monkey puppet for internet points. Talking normally to kids is not rocket science, and it's not stereotypical yuppies desperate to get their gifted darlings into AP class. It's very simple - little kids can handle normal speech just fine, so why use baby talk?
Because there's a ton of research that we adapted to do it for good reasons:
Infants between 6 and 8 months of age displayed a robust and distinct preference for speech with resonances specifying a vocal tract that is similar in size and length to their own. This finding, together with data indicating that this preference is not present in younger infants and appears to increase with age, suggests that nascent knowledge of the motor schema of the vocal tract may play a role in shaping this perceptual bias, lending support to current models of speech development.
Stanford psychologist Michael Frank and collaborators conducted the largest ever experimental study of baby talk and found that infants respond better to baby talk versus normal adult chatter.
TL;DR: Top parents are actually harming their kids' developmental process by being snobs about it.
You can also just talk normally to your kids without being a snob about anything.
It really depends on the kid and the complexity of the message. Young kids are still learning the intricacies of the language and building a vocabulary. Not talking down to them helps build those skills up. But at the end of the day, if the message is not getting across, it's the fault of the communicator.
Plus it's an annoying flex to say "see how amazing my kid is? It's all because of me!" Some kids just pick up language easier, some kids sleep all the way through the night earlier, some kids toilet train easier, etc. Usually it's better for parents to quietly take the little victory rather than treat it as a reflection of their amazing parenting skills.
We lived for three months in a brown paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six o’clock in the morning, clean the bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down mill for fourteen hours a day week in-week out. When we got home, out Dad would thrash us to sleep with his belt!
Well we had it tough. We used to have to get up out of the shoebox at twelve o’clock at night, and LICK the road clean with our tongues. We had half a handful of freezing cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at the mill for fourpence every six years, and when we got home, our Dad would slice us in two with a bread knife.
I had to roll a boulder to the top of a mountain each day. And at the top, my liver would get eaten by an eagle. Afterwards the boulder would roll down and I had to start my work all over again.
But what do I know, I only see shadows on a cave wall.
This sounds like something from LinkedIn.
If someone's toddler starts talking about how AI is a paradigm shift I'm going to dropkick it
I avoid the baby talk with my nieces and nephews after they get past one year old. My oldest nephew said I'm his favorite because I don't talk down to him
laughs in condescending to children at a level they just don't comprehend
Two notes from my actual coursework in education and psych; first, baby talk exists for a reason but it's the singasong voice that matters most, especially when they're picking up sounds. The funny thing there is you can say absolutely terrible things in a singasong voice and they will love it and remember it better.
Second, the arse in the example isn't actually all the way wrong, using vocabulary is important especially in that second and third year. I forget the author but there's some studies that show preschool vocabulary is directly related to parental education and they found it's because of the vocab the parents use. We're taking tens of thousands more words learned. Too bad I can't remember the author, just that it was four letters (and since leaving academia, my zotero is long gone).
Me, a chinese that only use one syllable word for my first 6 years: ._.
I don't do baby talk because I just don't like it. Not to babies not to animals.
I do find baby talk irritating, but to each their own. As long as they don't say anything to me for no baby talking I won't say anything for those who baby talk.
But I will just say that I'm under the impression that baby talk is done more for the talker wanting to talk like that, rather that for the listener to have a easier understanding, as I was always understood the same without baby talking and just trying to use simpler words for smaller kids but without that cartoon voice.
My cousin does the "no baby talk" things and it has pretty good results. Their kids are sharp, but of course not in a Twittiot way. Just in a "get good grades and communicate coherently" way.
I was non-verbal for almost the first five years, so good luck with that mister “parent of the year”.
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